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BrianG
New Member
USA
15 Posts |
 Posted - 10/21/2010 : 09:20:51 AM
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Home Depot has some dimmable LED light bulbs under the Home Depot brand of EcoSmart. They are made by Lighting Science Group corp. I tried the PAR-30 lights first. They are similar in size to the 65-watt bulbs, but they don’t fill out the recessed CAN lighting very well (lots of space around the bulb). I found the PAR-38 to be a much better fit. I also tried the PAR-20 lights for some smaller CANs that I have in my home. It’s a pretty short bulb and sits pretty far up in the CAN.
While the product claims that these bulbs are dimmable, they produce significant flickering at any setting other than 100% (with Insteon dimmers). I tried a number of different lights and a number of different Insteon dimmers. I even tried circuits with different numbers of bulbs (1, 2, 3, 4, 5 and 6) in case the issue was load related. My Insteon dimmers work great with several different dimmable CFL bulbs that I have tried, but not with the EcoSmart LED bulbs mentioned above.
In general, if I were to ignore the dimming issue, I really like this light and I think it’s getting close to the right price point for a 40-year LED bulb. The light from this bulb is somewhat directed. This is nice because you don’t get the glare from the recessed CAN lighting that you get with CFL bulbs (because they stick out further than incandescent bulbs). However, it would be nice if it were a little less directed than it currently is. The bulb is very bright. I like this, because I’m of the belief that you should get a brighter bulb than you normally need. Using an Insteon dimmer allows you to set a normal on/off setting that is something less than full brightness and a simple double-tap of the light switch give you the extra light when you need it. I would have retrofit my entire house of CAN lighting if they didn’t have the dimming problem.
I have contacted the company and they are looking into the issue. Hopefully, they will change their design to work with Insteon dimmers. I will post any updates as I get them.
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saltsman
New Member
USA
24 Posts |
Posted - 10/26/2010 : 9:11:25 PM
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| I purchased four of the Cree CR6 down lights and have been extremely happy. They dim perfectly with Insteon dimmers, look good, provide a nice even light. HomeDepot sells them under the EcoSmart brand as well. I'd never consider anything else for down lighting at this point. Way better than dimmable CFL's and honestly, very close in color and evenness to the old Halogen bulbs without the heat and UV. 300 Watts down to 42 with almost no loss in performance. |
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gatchel
Senior Member
USA
315 Posts |
Posted - 10/28/2010 : 07:00:38 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by BrianG
I have contacted the company and they are looking into the issue. Hopefully, they will change their design to work with Insteon dimmers. I will post any updates as I get them.
Maybe you could try another non insteon dimmer to see if it is the dimmer or the LED Lamp. Some lamps are not compaitble with certain dimmers. I had flicker issues with insteon dimmers and Cree LR6 lamps. IMHO the issue is with the Insteon dimmer not the LED Lamp. The Cree LR6 lamps looked fine with other non HA dimmers. Maybe there is an approved dimmer list that works with the EcoSmart PAR-38 lamps... |
Edited by - gatchel on 10/28/2010 07:04:27 AM |
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BLH
Advanced Member
3792 Posts |
Posted - 10/28/2010 : 07:05:49 AM
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I believe you will find an approved dimmer list on the EcoSmart web site.
I know I found a link to it on the HomeDepot web site. |
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dbx
Starting Member
USA
1 Posts |
Posted - 11/04/2010 : 2:13:23 PM
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| I have been looking for the past couple of weeks for led bulbs, I have 10 recessed can lights that are 65W halogen currently with Insteon dimmers. Since I am retired I am home alot so the lights are on quite a bit. I am looking for an led bulb that is dimmable, with a 60 degree minimum light cone, with a cool white light, something around 5000K or higher with at least a 55 lumens per watt ratio. Most that I have found has been something with a narrower light cone, usually in the 25 - 40 degree range, has anyone seen one with a larger light cone? I found some, but they were still in the $85 - $95 range. The ones on Smarthome don't have the necessary items listed on all models, something that should be listed with every model. |
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jaycanter
Starting Member
7 Posts |
Posted - 11/05/2010 : 04:55:10 AM
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| I have some 18 watt par 38 led bulbs that i have been using for over 3yrs now and work great. i have 10 can lights all on insteon dimmers and no problems. they are acuatuly 12 led dimmable to 20% and 1440 lumens. i have been testing differant manufacturers and this have been the best bulbs i have found. I replaced all my 4ft flourescent tubes with them, my outdoor floodlights, track lighting and all my floods. there from a electrical supply out of california. Can't remember the name. but if anybodys interested email me and i can look thru my emails for the info. |
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silverton38
Senior Member
Canada
279 Posts |
Posted - 11/05/2010 : 06:33:54 AM
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| I use a lot of LED lights. I gave up on dimming and use relay Switchlincs. I find that dimming is only really needed in a few places in my home. |
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Jdsmooth
Starting Member
11 Posts |
Posted - 11/05/2010 : 2:51:52 PM
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| Someone mentioned the Cree CR6 (which is sold at Home Depot under the EcoSmart name). It is by far the best option for LED retrofit into existing recessed lighting. it replaces the entire trim, looks modern and has great quality light output. I have 4 of them in my kitchen, and they dim down to about 20% without and issue on the Insteon Switchlinc dimmers. I was a bit nervous that they wouldn't work great, but they are actually brighter than the 65 Watt floods they replaced. They cost about $50 each, but you get 10% off if you use a HD card. |
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Oztronix
Average Member
USA
65 Posts |
Posted - 11/06/2010 : 10:42:12 AM
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Thanks everyone for the information in this thread. I picked 3 different LED bulbs to try out for my recessed lights from Home Depot yesterday. The first one I tried was the Ecosmart / Cree CR6. JDSmooth, you are right, these are brighter than the 65 watt bulb I removed. The color warmth was exactly the same as well.
Just for kicks I tried the other 2 bulbs. I couldn't pull them back out fast enough! They were narrow beams and looked like, well, they looked like LED bulb lights.
I reinstalled the Ecosmart bulb. I returned the other two bulbs and picked up 2 more Ecosmart bulbs for other locations this morning. I couldn't be happier these bulbs.
I figure they will pay for themselves in about 16 months.
Thanks again, |
Oz |
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Tfitzpatri8
Administrator
USA
6962 Posts |
Posted - 11/06/2010 : 10:47:07 AM
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Oz, do you have a product number by chance? What did you end up paying for them?
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Volunteer Moderator & Home Automation Enthusiast |
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Oztronix
Average Member
USA
65 Posts |
Posted - 11/06/2010 : 2:34:13 PM
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I have been looking all over the box for a part number or model number. The only number which resembles a part number is "499 485" in small print at the top right of the box. The barcode on the bottom of the box (and on the receipt) is 4897032600027 and on the receipt is discribed as 6" LED Trim. Ah, the instructions list it as CR6-575L.
Specs are: 65 Watt equivalent
575 Lumens
Lumens per Watt (Efficacy): 55
10.5 watt consumption (although all 3 I purchased measured 8 watts 100% PF @ 121 vrms).
Color Accuracy: 92
Light Color: 2700 (Warm White)
Oh and by the way it works great with Insteon SL dimmers, most of the way down to off.
I paid $49.99 each. If I had the Home Depot card would I would have paid 10% less as JDSmooth suggested. |
Oz |
Edited by - Oztronix on 11/06/2010 2:35:22 PM |
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gatchel
Senior Member
USA
315 Posts |
Posted - 11/06/2010 : 2:42:14 PM
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| 499485 is the HomeDepot SKU. That is all you need. I have several LR6. and the CR6's are right there as far as value goes. |
Edited by - gatchel on 11/06/2010 2:44:00 PM |
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Tfitzpatri8
Administrator
USA
6962 Posts |
Posted - 11/06/2010 : 2:46:33 PM
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Thanks for posting the details, nice to hear about a quality LED bulb that can be successfully dimmed. While the electricity savings add up, at $45 per bulb the ROI depends on them lasting as long as advertised.
(Curiously enough, searching for 499485 on the homedepot.com site brings up two products--the LED light bulb, and a 10-pack of bright pink flamingos. Pink flamingos! I didn't buy either option, but it is good to know where to find them if I ever want to really annoy the neighbors...) |
Volunteer Moderator & Home Automation Enthusiast |
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Oztronix
Average Member
USA
65 Posts |
Posted - 11/06/2010 : 4:14:06 PM
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| Yes, $45.00 is a lot for a lite bulb. The nice thing about these lights is the fact that the trim and the bulb are all once piece. The trim and inside reflector were yellowing (from the heat of the bulb)on my three and needed to be replaced, so I was able to justify the price of the bulbs. And they look a lot nicer than the old bulb and trim ever did! |
Oz |
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gatchel
Senior Member
USA
315 Posts |
Posted - 11/07/2010 : 5:13:46 PM
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| Look at it as a dual benefit. You can save money on electricity and if you caulk them in when installing them, you can stop the energy loss from recessed can leakage into the attic. |
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bmah
New Member
USA
28 Posts |
Posted - 11/09/2010 : 07:52:17 AM
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I'm trying out a couple of Sylvania 78494 (PAR 30 long neck) LED bulbs. They dim fairly well (to my untrained eye) with an Insteon SwitchLinc dimmer, but the beam angle is fairly narrow compared to the lights I was replacing (some sort of Sylvania halogen PAR 30 long neck flood). I haven't decided if I like these or not.
The EcoSmart / Cree CR6 bulbs sound interesting, but it looks like they won't work very well in a tilted ceiling, right?
Bruce.
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Oztronix
Average Member
USA
65 Posts |
Posted - 11/09/2010 : 2:50:45 PM
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| True, the bulbs are not adjustable however the light angle is wide so depending on your application it may not matter. One hallway in my house has a sloped ceiling where one can is located. The Ecosmart worked great in that location. |
Oz |
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gatchel
Senior Member
USA
315 Posts |
Posted - 11/10/2010 : 1:50:08 PM
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If you are looking for a wider beam angle the LR6 has its lens closer to the opening than the CR6. They are pretty close but the CR6 doesn't project as much light out to the sides of the lamp (at an angle of course).
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brk
Starting Member
10 Posts |
Posted - 11/18/2010 : 1:00:26 PM
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I just installed 10 CR6 and they would dim down to about 6% for me without flicker using the insteon dimmer. I have the 1000w switch - guess I don't need that anymore :) The dimming is not very linear up to about 18% but they all matched the steps so no big deal.
You can get the EcoSmart from the orange box store or get the CR6 from online. The CR6 has a better warranty but costs a bit more. Taking into account quantity discounts and tax savings I decided to purchase online. Ended up costing about $1.50 more per fixture for an additional 2 year warranty.
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BrianG
New Member
USA
15 Posts |
Posted - 11/19/2010 : 06:51:55 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by brk
I just installed 10 CR6 and they would dim down to about 6% for me without flicker using the insteon dimmer. I have the 1000w switch - guess I don't need that anymore :) The dimming is not very linear up to about 18% but they all matched the steps so no big deal.
You can get the EcoSmart from the orange box store or get the CR6 from online. The CR6 has a better warranty but costs a bit more. Taking into account quantity discounts and tax savings I decided to purchase online. Ended up costing about $1.50 more per fixture for an additional 2 year warranty.
Home Depot gives you 10% off light bulbs when you use a Home Depot card. They also take competitor coupons so I used a Lowes 10% off coupon to get a total of 20% off. This came out to $42.78 per CR6 (including tax).
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AD8BC
Senior Member
305 Posts |
Posted - 11/20/2010 : 2:09:22 PM
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| I was intrigued after reading this so I bought two of the CR6 retrofits this morning. I was going to put them in my living room but two of the four cans are very shallow and about 1/2" too short. So I replaced two of the kitchen ones and they play very nicely with the other three halogens on the dimmer! I like them a lot in fact, although I will need to come up with another solution in the living room in the two shallow cans. |
7 KPL, 3 SWL Dimmers, 3 ICON Relay Switches, 1 TGL Relay, 1 TGL Dimmer, 1 ILL Dimmer, 1 APL Relay, 6 LL, 1 ISY!!! and a partridge in a pear tree.<p>
Bill's Home Automation Blog: http://billshomeautomationblog.blogspot.com/ |
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Oztronix
Average Member
USA
65 Posts |
Posted - 11/20/2010 : 2:57:41 PM
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| When I went to install the CR6 bulbs in my kitchen they were about a ½” to short as well, but I lucked out. It turned out the cheap cans (at least I am pretty sure they were cheap) the lousy contractor installed had an adjustable top plate (that the bulb socket attaches to) so you could raise or lower the bulb as needed. It wasn’t real obvious to me at first that they would adjust. I am not sure how closely you looked at yours, but maybe by some luck…… |
Oz |
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AD8BC
Senior Member
305 Posts |
Posted - 11/20/2010 : 5:39:57 PM
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Naah. I took out the top plate with the socket in it and removed the socket and screwed the bulb right into it. The top of the socket was hitting the top of the can.
I don't think mine were short because they were cheap, I have a vaulted ceiling and on one half there is attic above it so they have full depth cans. The other side has the roof directly above so they could only fit shallow cans. |
7 KPL, 3 SWL Dimmers, 3 ICON Relay Switches, 1 TGL Relay, 1 TGL Dimmer, 1 ILL Dimmer, 1 APL Relay, 6 LL, 1 ISY!!! and a partridge in a pear tree.<p>
Bill's Home Automation Blog: http://billshomeautomationblog.blogspot.com/ |
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Chris Fox
New Member
16 Posts |
Posted - 11/22/2010 : 12:34:04 PM
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I picked up a CR6 to test out in my kitchen, and liked it so much that I bought 4 more to replace the other bulbs. I couldn't believe how much brighter the CR6 was than the mix of 55-65 Watt bulbs that I used to use. Very impressive for a 10.5W bulb!
The only downside (besides the cost) was the color: it was much "whiter" than I expected. Certainly alot more than the old bulbs. The fact that the dimmed very nicely with my Insteon dimmers made up for the color.
Now I just need to find something this good for table lamps and ceilings fans...
Chris |
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MrBillyd
Starting Member
6 Posts |
Posted - 04/21/2012 : 9:32:58 PM
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I know this link is old, but I will give a price update for the CR6 Cree in the Eco Smart Box.
HomeDepot has them down to 39 now.
I hope they drop further
Bill |
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jdale
Advanced Member
USA
1019 Posts |
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JimDavis
Starting Member
USA
2 Posts |
Posted - 04/24/2012 : 8:46:08 PM
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I don't think anyone has mentioned it, but I find the LED light to be harsh and glaring. Certainly a bright light is needed in some areas but a ceiling full of LED lights .... dimmed, doesn't have the same effect as if they were incandescent bulbs. The low power consumption of LED's is desireable, but at this point I've bought about 200 incandescent bulbs of various types to hold me over until they get this right.
It would seem to me that if these manufacturers wanted to integrate their products into the market quicker, that they would try to replicate the incandescent warmness that everyone is used to. I mean .... all it would take would be some kind of a "tan" film/filter on the lens to recreate or at least come close to the color of filiment bulbs. Or color the plastic that the LED's are made of.
Also, why can't the LED's be dimmed all the way down? I find it annoying that they dim to a certain level and then they flicker and then blink out. Same with turn on. When ramping up, they don't turn on ... they don't turn on ............ and then all of a sudden they're on at about one quarter brightness and ramp up from there. That's not what I would call a "dimmable" light. I like to watch TV in "subdued" light. There doesn't seem to be such a thing with LED lights.
When working with LED's with a DC voltage source, LED's seem to have a greater dimming range. Why not with AC? I have to presume that they're converting the voltage to DC, so why doesn't it dim all the way down?
Any comments on this?? |
Edited by - JimDavis on 04/24/2012 8:54:35 PM |
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MrBillyd
Starting Member
6 Posts |
Posted - 04/24/2012 : 11:24:18 PM
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The Cree CR 6 does replicate an incandescent light.
This LED is not like some that have 8 or so bright LEDs.
This has a diffused lens, so you cannot even tell it's an LED.
The warmness is the same spectrum 2700, and most others are 3000
The other bonus is they seal your can.
-Bill |
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jdale
Advanced Member
USA
1019 Posts |
Posted - 04/25/2012 : 07:32:54 AM
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| Everything you are saying is about quality. There are good LED bulbs and bad ones. There is a limit to how low they can dim but the Philips bulbs, for example, go down at least to 10% without flickering, then turn off. Light color is fairly warm. The Cree CR6 is also a great light. There are plenty of bulbs that flicker at higher brightness settings, or that have a more white/blue color, but it's not true anymore that they all do. |
Insteon FAQ: http://goo.gl/qNTNr |
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blueman2
Starting Member
USA
7 Posts |
Posted - 04/25/2012 : 8:14:37 PM
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WOW!!!! I just went to Home Depot and they are selling the Cree CR6's (under a store brand) for $35. They have the newer 9.5W version with the same output as the older 10.5W. Actually, they have both the old and new with same part number, and I bought the newer ones.
They work fantastically!!!! They dim to almost zero. And they are much brighter than a 65W bulb they replaced. They look MUCH more modern and clean too. And since they are now more air tight, I am sure they will save some money in heat loss as well. I went back and bought 10 to replace every 6" can I have in my house. I also bought 2 4" cans since I have about 18 of those in my house. Downside is that they are $49 vs $35 for the 6". But they are pretty much just the same. Same great look. Dim down to pretty much zero light. No buzz and no perceptible flicker.
Fantastic!!!! |
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JimDavis
Starting Member
USA
2 Posts |
Posted - 04/26/2012 : 7:17:37 PM
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Welllll Ok. You convinced me to at least take another shot at it. Next time I go to HD I'll invest in a couple of the CR6's. Oh .... if they DO work out ..... anyone interested in some great incandescents at a discount price?  |
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Topic |
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Dimmable LED Light Bulbs
